In this episode, Josh interview’s Amiel Handelsman on why it’s important to deracialize people as part of combatting racism. Listen to Episode 181 here or in your favorite podcast app.
Links from the show:
- Amiel Handelsman’s free essay: How to Be an Anti-race Antiracist
- Two part blog series: Why Deracializing People is Essential To Combatting Racism Part 1, Part 2
- Amiel Handelsman’s Website: www.amielhandelsman.com
Hi Josh!
I really appreciated this conversation. Earlier tonight, I read Amiel’s blog posts on deracialization on Greg’s website. And, I found this talk after I searched for more info on Amiel’s perspective on deracialization. I’ll read Amiel’s e-book in the next couple of days.
Thank you for the thoroughness of your questions, Josh. I too had a question related to cultural appropriation, when I read Amiel’s blog posts earlier. So, it was great to get an immediate answer to my question because of your question.
I’ve been studying everything that I can find on antiracism since the end of 2019. And, I started using the phrases “racialized as black” and “racialized as white,” after reading the terms in Rhonda Magee’s book “The Inner Work of Racial Justice” in 2020. Since then, when I say “black” or “white,” I intend those terms to be “shorthand” for racialization. And, I’ve explained that I use those terms as shorthand for racialization with people in conversations. I’m going to start incorporating the “Black identified” and “White Identified” terms as I move forward.
Additionally, your question about how to “practice” as an “anti-race antiracialist” reminded me that, for years now, I’ve been intentionally making it a practice not to identify someone’s race when I’m telling a story, unless “racialization” is important to the story. For example, I’ll just say “this woman I met,” instead of saying “this Latinx woman I met.”
I’ll be reflecting more on and having conversations with others using the question “How do we reinforce the myth of biological race?,” after listening to your conversation with Amiel. I think that question will help surface more practices or “conversational micro-habits” that Amiel raised.
Also, I studied Integral theory/Ken Wilber’s work during my graduate studies. And, I’m seeing some synthesis of my studies of antiracism being aided by the AQAL model.